Differetial Breathers
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 97 14:10:00 PST
From: "Tong, Don MV"
Subject: Differential Breathers
To: "'Toy4x4@tlca.org'"
Following Jack Alford's notes on the installation of breather
differentials (http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota/cheaptr.html), I
installed differential breathers on my 4-Runner over the holidays.
Here's what I found out.
The engine block fitting for the hose running from the intake manifold to
the power brake unit (not power steering as reported) does indeed fit the
differential. It's a bit longish and requires use of 3/8 inch hose. The
part is $6.50 or so from the dealer.
I spoke with a number of companies on the phone and suspect that the
fitting is actually a 1/8" BSP (British Standard Pipe). Naturally these
are hard to find and I didn't care to pay for the parts plus shipping to
find out I was wrong.
I did the rear differential first, finally deciding to go with the 1/8"
NPT tap and use standard 1/8" fittings. ($4.50 for the tap and $1.00 for
the fitting versus $6.50 from the dealer, and you get to keep the tap!)
This works well on the rear differential; lots of room to work back
there. If your spare tire isn't mounted underneath, you can even sit
crossed-legged down there while working.
Jack notes that when he did his axles, he had them off the car. I assume
"axles" meant both front and back - lucky him. Trying to put a
differential breather on the front while it's on the car is "different".
There's hardly any clearance to get the existing breather out, much less
try to use a tap. The oil pan is also pretty close, and the fitting from
the intake manifold is too long. There's also no room for an elbow due
to the proximity of one of the bolts for (I think) the A.D.D. mechanism.
My solution was to remove the cap from the breather; since the cap is
held on only by a crimp, it's easy enough to use a screwdriver to pry out
the crimp and remove the cap. This can be done without removing the
breather first. Removing the cap reveals a short fitting shaped
something like a ""T" with the center hollowed out. A 3/8" hose fits
this nicely, and since this hose is not under pressure, I assume that
clamping the hose to the fitting will hold adequately.
The rest of the installation is the same - run the hose to someplace high
and terminate with a small filter.
In retrospect, if I'd known the solution for the front before I did the
rear, I'd have done the rear the same way. Don't have to buy taps or
fittings, just hose, filters, and clamps.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 04 Jan 1997 23:18:32 -0600
From: Jack Alford
Subject: Differential Breathers
To: toy4x4@tlca.org
"Tong, Don MV" wrote:
>Following Jack Alford's notes on the installation of breather
>differentials (http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota/cheaptr.html), I
Sorry if you feel I led you astray ...
>In retrospect, if I'd known the solution for the front before I did the
>rear, I'd have done the rear the same way. Don't have to buy taps or
>fittings, just hose, filters, and clamps.
I figured most folks would try that first ... I tried it and the hose
kept coming off, so I went another route ... sorry I neglected
to mention the little stock piece.
The BEST solution is to get the axle vent fitting off a Nissan pu, it's
a lot longer than the Toy one, so it holds onto the hose when clamped
like a regular hose barb and since it's a foreign vehicle it has
metric threads and screws right into the existing hole. Wish I'd have
known THIS when I did mine ...
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Alford Off-Road.com - The best dirt on the net!
jalford@off-road.com http://www.off-road.com/
Decatur, AL
'86 Xcab Toyota Pickup - 33x12.50 BFG MT
Solid Front Axle - Marlin Crawler - ARB
SFWDA - TLCA #3415 - Rocket City Rock Crawlers
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 5 Jan 1997 12:14:22 -0800
From: rmurray@gvn.net (Rick Murray)
Subject: Differential breathers
To: TOY4X4@TLCA.ORG
>The BEST solution is to get the axle vent fitting off a Nissan pu, it's
>a lot longer than the Toy one, so it holds onto the hose when clamped
>like a regular hose barb and since it's a foreign vehicle it has
>metric threads and screws right into the existing hole. Wish I'd have
>known THIS when I did mine ...
Another solution is to use air fittings from Toyota EFI units.
They fit perfectly in the axle, replacing the stock axle vents. Not sure
if they will fit into the IFS front axle, but I assume the stock vent
is the same. I got a couple of them (no charge, since they were classified
as bolts) from a wrecker. 7/32" hose goes over them nice and snug, no
need for clamps. I have a long hose leading all they way to the engine
compartment from the rear. Both are splice together, so I can use one
filter (a piece of sponge). My only cost was the hose and the 'Y' fitting,
about 8 bucks altogether.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 18:22:37 -0800
From: rmurray@gvn.net (Rick Murray)
Subject: Diff. breathers
To: TOY4X4@TLCA.ORG
Another solution is to use air fittings from Toyota EFI units.
They fit perfectly in the axle, replacing the stock axle vents. Not sure
if they will fit into the IFS front axle, but I assume the stock vent
is the same. I got a couple of them (no charge, since they were classified
as bolts) from a wrecker. 7/32" hose goes over them nice and snug, no
need for clamps. I have a long hose leading all they way to the engine
compartment from the rear. Both are spliced together, so I can use one
filter (a piece of sponge). My only cost was the hose and the 'Y' fitting,
about 8 bucks altogether for both diffs. (You say Downey wants $50 each ?
I hope they use vaseline).
##################################################################
Rick Murray 84 Toyota 4Runner SR5
rmurray@gvn.net stock 22R motor ; 3" ProComp Lift
http://www.gvn.net/~rmurray/ 8" steel rims; 33" BFG M/T
Rancho Cordova, Ca. 4.88 gears; Marlin TCase #67 ; TRD LSD
##################################################################
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 1997 00:38:20 -0500
From: WartHog
Subject: Diff. breathers
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Rick Murray wrote:
> Both are spliced together, so I can use one
> filter (a piece of sponge). My only cost was the hose and the 'Y' fitting,
> about 8 bucks altogether for both diffs. (You say Downey wants $50 each ?
> I hope they use vaseline).
They sure do. With 80 grit sand.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 15:44:12 -0500
From: "Chad Daniel Zimmer"
Subject: diff breathers
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I installed diff breathers on my 89 just last week. I read the article on diff
breathers on Off-road.com and decided that I didn't want to retap the hole or
search through a junkyard for one off of a Nissan. So I went out and bought 3/8
inside diamater fuel hose, 4 hose clamps, and two filters. The hose is big
enough to slip over the lip after the little cap is removed. It's not much to
grab onto but it is enough to clamp to. I ran the back one up in the wheel well
with the gas filler hose and I ran the front one into the engine compartment.
If doing this on a ifs truck it is easier to do if you remove the front skid
plate. This may not be the best way to do things but it seems to work, so far.
I hope this helps.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 12:56:46 -0800 (PST)
From: Chris Geiger
Subject: diff breathers
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
> I installed diff breathers on my 89 just last week. I read the article on diff
> breathers on Off-road.com and decided that I didn't want to retap the hole or
> search through a junkyard for one off of a Nissan. So I went out and bought 3/8
> inside diamater fuel hose, 4 hose clamps, and two filters. The hose is big
> enough to slip over the lip after the little cap is removed. It's not much to
> grab onto but it is enough to clamp to. I ran the back one up in the wheel well
> with the gas filler hose and I ran the front one into the engine compartment.
> If doing this on a ifs truck it is easier to do if you remove the front skid
> plate. This may not be the best way to do things but it seems to work, so far.
> I hope this helps.
>
I ran both diff breathers to a T and then up to the top of the engine near
the fire wall
Chris Geiger
http://home1.gte.net/cgeiger/offroad.html
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 11:04:53 -0500
From: john skaggs
Subject: Diff Breathers
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
To anyone that may be doing the Diff Breather changeover, using Ni$$an parts.
Here in Ohio there is not a very large selection of Japanese junk yards
(see they do last longer), so I went to the dealer for the part, I had a hard
time finding a person at the counter that was smarter than the counter:-)
But ayway here is the part # 38323-C6010. These fit perfectly, on my 85 4Runner
solid axle. Don't know about IFS.
Hope this can help someone.
Oh, the price for these was $ 4.00 each
John Skaggs
TLCA # waiting
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 20:41:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Geiger
Subject: sick of hearing about differential breathers yet?
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
> > I was just wondering, you know how everyone uses air or fuel filters to top
> > off their extended diff. breathers- wouldn't it be better to use a one-way
> > check valve instead? Could a PCV valve be used? I don't know if those are
> > one-way or not...
>
> I don't think so, because the air (in the diff/trans whatever) needs room
> to expand and contract. But this makes me wonder if you couldnt' use some
> kind of balloon (bike inner tube maybe??) instead of an air filter.
> Anybody?
Toyota uses a check valve at 5 different points, front and rear diff,
xfer, and 2 on the trans (on my 93 V6). These usually work for short trips
thru water but still create a vacume in deep water and then the water gets
sucked in thru the pinion seals.
As for the balloon this would allow for expansion but after a long trip
the pressure in the balloon will leak out of the pinion seal along with
gear lube and then when you hit water, will again take on water.
In my opinion both diff's should be vented to the fire wall or higher. And
don't vent into the cab as soon as the diff's get hot it will stink real
bad.
Chris Geiger '93 4Runner http://geiger.mcl.ucsb.edu/offroad.html
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 09:44:11 -0700
From: Eric Johnson
Subject: Diff Breathers
To: "'Toy4x4@tlca.org'"
john skaggs wrote:
> To anyone that may be doing the Diff Breather changeover, using Ni$$an
parts.
> Here in Ohio there is not a very large selection of Japanese junk yards
> (see they do last longer), so I went to the dealer for the part, I had a
hard
> time finding a person at the counter that was smarter than the counter:-)
> But ayway here is the part # 38323-C6010. These fit perfectly, on my 85
4Runner
> solid axle. Don't know about IFS.
> Hope this can help someone.
>
> Oh, the price for these was $ 4.00 each
John, I finally picked up those parts, and was pleased the see that they
definitely fit correctly (at least in the rear axle, haven't tried the
front.
I have a monthly section called 'Cheap Tricks' on the 4runner pages at
off-road.com. For next month or the month after I think I'm going to put
together a full instruction set for making some cheap diff breathers, using
that part and the VW filters that I think Jack Alford came up with,
complete with pictures, etc. If its ok with you, I think I'll give credit
to you and Jack for the idea...
- --
- -- ej@blarg.net
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 18:04:36 PDT
From: "marc shirah"
Subject: Diff Breather
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
today while I was changing the fluid in my rear diff,I looked up at the breather
vent and had a suden idea,I have a 4-foot section of surgical tubing(1/4 inch
diameter??) that I "borrowed" from my step-dad.I can get it to slip over the
vent nipple,it holds on fairly well,but I want to be extra careful.Anybody got
any Ideas aabout how to clamp/attach it more securely. And also,is surgical
tubing okay to use? also,I noticed quite a bit of metal shavings in the gear
oil,I replaced it with Castrol 80w90. I think I better quit Power Braking those
31 in. mud tires in the school parking lot!!
Marc Shirah
16
95 Tacoma Reg. cab
31 in. Sidewinder MT's
4 banger/auto tranny
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 18:59:52 EDT
From: matt877@juno.com (Matthew C Chapin)
Subject: Diff Breather
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>any Ideas aabout how to clamp/attach it more securely<
I have done the same thing in my 81 but not w/ surgical tubing just 1/4"
R/C model fuel hose. I tried regular hose clamps but they didn't work
too well, so I used R/C hose clamps instead. They are made to hold such
small tubing tightly and through alot of vibration.
Matt Chapin
matt877@juno.com
81' 4x4 SR5
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 06:26:32 -0600
From: "Steve and Carole"
To: "Toyota Info TLCA"
I tried regular hose clamps but they didn't work
too well, so I used R/C hose clamps instead. They are made to hold such
small tubing tightly and through alot of vibration
I have had regular fuel line with small hose clamps on both my diffs for
over a year now and have never had a problem with them slipping off.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 08:48:44 -0700
From: Eric Johnson
Subject: Diff Breather
To: "'Toy4x4@tlca.org'"
Matthew C Chapin wrote:
>
> >any Ideas aabout how to clamp/attach it more securely<
>
> I have done the same thing in my 81 but not w/ surgical tubing just 1/4"
> R/C model fuel hose. I tried regular hose clamps but they didn't work
> too well, so I used R/C hose clamps instead. They are made to hold such
> small tubing tightly and through alot of vibration.
FWIW: I finished my diff breathers last night, and used 7/32 inch vacuum
hose, with normal hose clamps.
Also, FYI: The Nissan part numbers John Skaggs supplied fit in both the 8"
toy differential housing, as well as the 7.5" IFS front differential. The
nipple is a little long on the front, causing the hose to rub against the
oil pan; I might bend mine or put in a right-angle fitting it it rubs
through. You have to drop the skid plate (easy, 4 bolts) to get to the
front differential breather.
- --
- -- ej@blarg.net
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:55:54 -0700
From: Eric Johnson
Subject: Diff Breather
To: "Toy4x4@tlca.org"
On Monday, April 28, 1997 1:30 PM, Greg S.
Francis[SMTP:gfrancis@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu] wrote:
>
> >Also, FYI: The Nissan part numbers John Skaggs supplied fit in both the
8"
> >toy differential housing, as well as the 7.5" IFS front differential.
>
> Could you repost those part numbers?
> Thanks.
You'll need Nissan part # 38323-C6010 (God bless you John Skaggs!), one for
each axle, about $4 each. A 14mm wrench to get the old breathers out. Be
sure to clean off the housing around the opening so you don't drop dirt
inside. The Nissan parts will need a 12mm wrench to install.
I used 7/32 I.D. vaccuum hose, but any similar size hose will work. If you
want cheap filtration at the top end, your auto parts store will probably
have a bulk bin of "import fuel filters" for 99 cents. These will work, and
are actually a VW filter. If you wanna go name brand, the filter is a Fram
G4164, it will run about $2.99, but comes with some hose clamps that look
like they'll fit. I simply used cable ties to tie the dry end up high, but
you might come up with something more creative. Be sure to have enough
slack in the hose for full articulation. Also be careful to route the hose
away from the exhaust in the rear and moving engine parts in the front.
This is MUCH cheaper than the $40 or $50 NWOR or Downey kits; I don't know
how they can get away with charging that much. Total cost per axle here is
about $7.
- --
- - ej@blarg.net
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:28:30 -0500
From: Chris Caldwell
Subject: diff breathers
To: 4x4 digest
So far, I haven't seen any info regarding the Nissan breather part
concerning the Tacoma's. Well, I finally got a chance to try out the one
that I ordered from Nissan and it fits just fine in the rear of my
Tacoma.The front is stock with the tube extended high in the engine
compartment so nothing needed done there. I even had the idea to
purchase this front set-up from Toyota, only to find out that to order
just the front axle tube, it would have cost me $43.
Thanks to whom ever originated the part suggestion!
price was only $2.72
Chris Caldwell
caldwell@vol.com
(95.5 Tacoma Xcab 4x4 V6, TJM Bullbar, K&N, soon a Lock-right)
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 7 May 1997 14:30:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: TXPakRat@aol.com
Subject: Diff Breather
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I installed front and rear diff breathers this weekend (after I installed
my air horns). Thanks to whoever came up with the Nissan part number for the
"breather connector." It worked like a champ and only cost me $2.70 each
(plus tax, of course!).
I have a question, though. The stock breathers had a tapered body and
only screwed in about half way. The Nissan breather connectors had a
straight body. In the rear, the breather screwed all the way down with no
problem. The front (IFS) was very hard to get to and it only screwed down
about half way. It is as tight as I can possibly get it (virtually rounded
off the edges!). I hand started it, so, I am pretty sure that it is not
cross threaded. That only leaves maybe 1/2" to 1" clearance for the vacuum
line to bend over the connector. Because of this, the vacuum line actually
touches the oil pan (the breather connector does not!).
1. Is the front breather connector only supposed to go half way, or
do I need to back it out (get a new one) and try again?
2. Will the vacuum line touching the oil pan be damaged (rubbing,
heat, etc.)?
I ran the rear line along the inside of the frame rail to the base of the
fire wall on the passenger side. I ran the front line to the same point. I
connected the lines with a T-connector and ran the "new" single line to the
top of the fire wall above the fender well. I put the filter on the end of
the line and bent it over (into an upside down U) with the filter pointing
down.
I took lots of pics, so I will have them developed and put into a jpg
format. Let me know if anyone is interested.
Thanks again to those folks who outlined how to do this in past messages!
And, thanks to those who answer my questions above!
Bob
Pack Rat
TXPakRat@aol.com
'90 4Runner V6
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 07 May 1997 21:45:31 -0400
From: "R. W. 'Butch' Stiles"
Subject: Diff Breather
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Because of this, the vacuum line actually
> touches the oil pan (the breather connector does not!).
>
> 1. Is the front breather connector only supposed to go half way, or
> do I need to back it out (get a new one) and try again?
>
> 2. Will the vacuum line touching the oil pan be damaged (rubbing,
> heat, etc.)?
>
> Bob
> Pack Rat
> TXPakRat@aol.com
> '90 4Runner V6
Bob, I used different fittings, but I found the same thing on my '93
truck. The front housing appears to have tapered threads while the rear
housing has straight threads. My front fitting went roughly half way,
while the rear one went all the way to the bottom.
Regarding #2, the vacuum line WILL be damaged by contact with the oil
pan. Remember, the engine moves, A LOT! Every time you give it throttle,
let out the clutch, etc. I ended up using a tee fitting with one end
plugged to get clearance. I found a gauge adapter kit at Pep Boys that
has the correct size for the housing and adapts to 1/8" NPT female. From
there I used a stainless -4 AN fitting and braided teflon hose. (fringe
benefits of my last job, don't tell anyone!) I know that's out of most
people's reach, but that's a tight area and some sort of elbow is almost
a necessity. Oh well, good luck, hope I've been a little help.
- --
Butch Stiles
rokitman@erols.com
Just as it says, "Rocket Man"
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 07 May 1997 20:10:26 -0500
From: Chris Caldwell
Subject: diff breathers
To: 4x4 digest
I also wanted to join Bob in saying thanks to whomever provided the
Nissan part number for the diff breather tube. Just installed the rear
today and it was a breeze. The front already has one and only needs to
be lengthened about a foot. Between the tube, the 7/32 vacuum tubing,
and some nifty rubberized hose brackets that I found, it cost me less
than $7.
Actually, I could take this opprotunity to say that I have gone back
through all of the back issues and I have found quite a few helpful
topics. For this I say THANKS to all that have contributed.
Chris Caldwell
caldwell@vol.com
(95.5 Tacoma Xcab 4x4 V6, TJM Bullbar, K&N, soon a Lock-right)
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 07 May 1997 20:50:18 -0500
From: Chris Caldwell
Subject: Diff Breathers
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Scott Wilson wrote:
>
> Darn it! I was just about to go and buy my Nissan parts to make those
> diff breathers...but I lost the part #'s. Any one got 'em still?
>
> Scott
> --
> Scott A. Wilson __o __o __o __o
> Santa Clara, CA _'\<,_ _'\<,_ _'\<,_ _'\<,_
> swilson@pacbell.net (_)' (_) (_)' (_) (_)' (_) (_)' (_)
> http://users.uniserve.com/~rcomber/scottw/scottw.htm
Hey Scott,
Just in case you haven't received the Nissan number yet:
38323-C6010
Chris Caldwell
caldwell@vol.com
(95.5 Tacoma Xcab 4x4 V6, TJM Bullbar, K&N, soon a Lock-right)
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:54:45 EST
From: "james stevenson"
Subject: Leaking axle
To: aph120@psu.edu, Toy4x4@tlca.org
The "valve thingy" is called a breather. As the diff heats up pressure
in the diff releases. Under the cap is a ball bearing or bit of rubber
and a spring. This is ment to stop water getting in. But if you go near
water relocate the breather up above the water to be sure. For oil to be
thrown out you world need a lot of pressure or have overfilled the diff.
Did you fill the diff on a flat lever surface?. Normally the diff leaks
from the hub seals when the breather becomes blocked that's common.
However some oil is always leaking through the breather but it should
never be enough to run down the diff if it is get it checked.To be sure
go see a diff specialist and get it checked.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 16:35:40 -0800
From: "Roger Brown P.E."
Subject: Extended diff. vent lines.
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I just ran into a bit of a problem related to my extended vent lines that I
thought I'd pass along. It seems some gear oil makes its way up into the vent
lines and over time collects in any low spots. In my case, enough oil built up
to effectively block the vent tube. Since the oil in the line doesn't get
heated, it retains its heavy viscosity and can hinder the flow of air in/out of
the diff. to a degree. This seemed to be enough to cause an oil leak in the
rear axle. I pulled the lines off and was able to blow out the trapped oil.
I'm thinking of re-routing the lines such that they allow trapped oil to flow
back into the diff. As such, I'll keep the front diff vented to the firewall,
but the rear diff will need to be vented at the rear of the truck, so that the
long horizontal vent run to the front is eliminated.
- --
Roger Brown, P.E. mailto:rogerb@sgi.com
+1.650.933.1898 (vmail) +1.650.932.1898 (fax)
http://reality.sgi.com/rogerb/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 20:18:24 -0800
From: Ken Emanuel
Subject: Extended diff. vent lines.
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Roger Brown P.E. wrote:
>
> I just ran into a bit of a problem related to my extended vent lines that I
> thought I'd pass along. It seems some gear oil makes its way up into the vent
> lines and over time collects in any low spots. Since the oil in the line
> doesn't get heated, it retains its heavy viscosity and can hinder the flow of
> air in/out of the diff. to a degree. This seemed to be enough to cause an oil
> leak in the rear axle.
I think this is the cause of my now-leaking rear axle seal. It is
leaking from the gasket where the 3rd member bolts to the rear axle.
How difficult is this gasket to replace? Do I need any special tools
for sliding the axles out in order to get the 3rd member out?
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Ken Emanuel Emanuel@csus.edu
'87 Xtra Cab SR5 (22R-E)
http://webpages.csus.edu/~sac75830/toystuff.htm
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
------------------------------
Back to the top of this thread
Back to the top of the Tips - Techniques group
Back to the top of the Toy Thread Tree