EFI Problems

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Date: Sun, 18 May 1997 02:40:40 -0700
From: James Brink 
Subject: no cold idle
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

R. W. 'Butch' Stiles wrote:
> 
> This is for Jim Brink, our resident Toyota GURU.
> 
> Jim, on the wife's car ('86 Celica GT, 2S-E motor), the cold idle up
> isn't working anymore. When you start it up cold, you have to sit there
> with your foot on the gas like some old carbureted dinosaur. Can you
> point out the most likely culprits? 

Butch,

The problem is most likely in the air valve or the hoses that route the
bypassed air around the throttle body. Check the hoses to make sure they
are still attached and/or not broken or cracked. Check the resistance of
the heater coil resistance of the air valve  at the connector (should be
around 38-60 ohms). With the engine warm, restrict the airflow through
the valve by pinching off one of the hoses. The idle speed should not
drop more than 50 rpm. You can even remove the valve and inspect it
visually. Cold, you should be able to see through the hose passages.
With the valve warm, the passage should be closed. I have used a heat
gun or hair dryer on the coil portion of the valve to check this.
Removal of the valve is simple, just a bolt or two, the air hoses, and a
few coolant hoses. Some coolant will leak out, so be prepared to catch
it. Clean up any spilled coolant, animals love it (except my dogs, they
have "shop experience").

If the air valve checks out O.K. I would look at the cold-start injector
and the c.s.i. time switch.

Let me know what you find with the air valve inspection.

- -- 

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Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 19:05:05 -0700
From: James Brink 
Subject: Trouble Starting/Black Smoke
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

s99steiglema@usuhsb.usuhs.mil wrote:
> 
> I have an '88 V6 with 112K that has begun to have trouble starting since
> the weather has gotten warm.  I recently replaced the battery and don't
> think the problem is electric--if I pump the gas it starts after 3,4 tries
> I don't know if the pumping is curative or merely coincidental.  I also
> recently (3 mos.) replaced plugs, cap, and rotor.  Bye the bye, by paying
> more attention to my truck since this intermittent starting problem, I have
> noticed black smoke on starting/heavy accelerating and soot in my tailpipe.
> I don't know if they are related.
> 
> Does anybody have any ideas?  I was told that I may try the "coolant sensor"
> or possibly my O2 sensor is bad.  Am I on the right track--or is it probably
> something else?
> 
> Thanks,
> Allan

It could be the coolant or 02 sensor but I would also look at the
cold-start injector and time switch for proper operation. It appears
that the engine is running too rich. Have you checked for codes yet. Is
the air filter element in good shape or is it filled with crud? I know
I'm probably not much help but a step by step inspection of each of
these components is neccesary for proper EFI diagnosis. Just because you
MAY have an 02 sensor code (or coolant temp, air temp., etc.) , do not
go out and just replace the sensor. The computer does not know if the
sensor is bad, it just know the voltage it is working at and what the
parameters are for proper functioning. 

Good luck.


- -- 
Jim Brink				1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician		135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net			32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
					Stock 4.10 gears
					Rear Lock-Right (TRD)

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Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 11:24:56 -0400
From: grandall@tmac.com
Subject: 22RE misses after stop
To: Toyota Users Group 

     My '85 22re truck with 125K miles has developed a strange miss.  It 
     seems to only happen after coming to a rapid stop or slowdown after 
     high speed driving.  When starting up from the stop it will almost die 
     out, buck four or five times, and then get underway OK.  If I take it 
     easy coming to a stop, it doesn't seem to happen.  Any suggestions?
     
     Gary Randall - Brunswick, Maine

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Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 12:23:01
From: Ed Ruf 
Subject: 22RE misses after stop
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

Check the dashpot on the of the throttle linkage for adjustment and
function. This is there just to prevent the thottle plate in the
throttle body from abruptly to the fully closed position. After that I
might check the air valve and it's plumbing.

Ed
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Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 09:58:04 -0700
From: Eric Johnson 
Subject: 22RE misses after stop
To: "'Toy4x4@tlca.org'" 

That's my general 'first culprit' for anything ignition related on a Toy, 
but more often than not, I'm right. Definitely worth a few $$ to try out. 
Also, you might want to check your coil and other ignition components (cap, 
rotor, plugs, etc). But try the wires first.
- --
- -- ej@blarg.net

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Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 22:30:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: DRM033@aol.com
Subject: Engine still missing, and worse now
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

Ok.  I took the advice I was given.  Changed the plugs, plug wires, new coil,
I even shelved the K&N for a nice & cheap paper filter(I hate cleaning the
K&N!).  I pulled the EFI idle adjustment screw and cleaned it and I sprayed
cleaner in the intake (These were recommended by a Toy mechanic).  The miss
is still there.  I will run down the symptoms again in case anyone can help
me with this:

The engine misses.  It is at ne specific RPM range.  It tends to be worse
when accelerating hard.  It ranges from light to heavy in terms of how bad
the miss is.  It is not always there. It is not rhythmic.  Not sure if this
is related, but the aftermarket tach I just installed is acting up.  This
tach connects to the negative side of the coil to get its reading.  It will
jump at the same time that the engine misses.  It also acts up at other
times, usually at higher RPMs.( Any help on this would be appreciated also)  

The tach acting up made me think it is electrical.  The only other thought I
have is that it could be the injectors.  Maybe they are clogged or something.
 I changed the fuel filter a while ago, but the miss was present before that.
 What are some other things to check?  Am I missing something obvious?(no pun
intended)

David
DRM033@aol.com   

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Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 22:14:43 -0700
From: James Brink 
Subject: Engine still missing, and worse now
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

David,

Have you checked for any vacuum leaks at the intake manifold or EGR
valve fittings? When was the last time you adjusted the valves? If the
valves are set too tight, it will cause a miss at idle and at high speed
under load (especially on the inline sixes).

Just some things to check...
- -- 
Jim Brink                               1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician         135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net                   32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
                                        Stock 4.10 gears
                                        Rear Lock-Right (TRD)

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Date: Wed, 21 May 1997 19:10:51 -0400
From: "R. W. 'Butch' Stiles" 
Subject: Engine still missing, and worse now
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org


David,
	The only thing you didn't mention is the ignitor. This is what 
actually fires the coil. It is (I believe) really only an amplifier that
punches up the signal from the distributor to drive the coil harder and
get a hotter spark. This is essential in the lean burning engines we
have today. 
 If the ignitor is breaking down under load, then you will experience
symptoms exactly like you have described. Regarding your tach, it is
(electrically speaking) hooked up right to the output of the ignitor.
This also leads me to believe that the ignitor is having trouble.
However, to be sure, I would also have a good look at the distributor as
well to make sure the ignitor is getting a good signal.
Remember, garbage in = garbage out! Later...
- -- 
Butch Stiles 
rokitman@erols.com
Just as it says, "Rocket Man"

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Date: Thu, 22 May 1997 11:59:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: DRM033@aol.com
Subject: Engine still missing, and worse now
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org

In a message dated 97-05-21 21:05:24 EDT, you write:

> 
>  OK David, give over, WHAT was it?!! You can't just leave us hanging like
>  that!
>  -- 
>  Butch Stiles 
>  rokitman@erols.com
>  Just as it says, "Rocket Man"

I was hoping no one would ask...  Loose ground bolt at the fuse block where I
was grounging my CB.  The fuse block is also grounded here, and it worked
it's way loose and was causing momentary electrical shorts, causing the miss.
 This was also why the tach was jumping around, poor ground.  
Sometimes you feel soooooo stupid.

David
DRM033@aol.com

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Date: Thu, 22 May 97 12:09:00 -0500
From: Rosenberger Bud 
Subject: Engine still missing, and worse now
To: "mail@UUCP {Toy4x4@tlca.org}" 

We're all glad that you found your engine (engine was missing, right! :))   
but could you tell us where you found it?  It may help someone else.   
After all, isn't that what this is all about?  Thanks, Bud

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