Name That Noise
> From: shellqn@caller.infi.net
> Subject: name that noise....
> To: TLCAL@tlca.org
>
> My truck is making this gawdawful noise when i make sharp
> turns, sounding like metal grating against metal...doesn't matter which
> direction i'm turning...i've heard other toyotas make this same noise...sure
> gets the attention of anyone within a few hundred yards. a bit
> embarrassing...is this terminal?
>
> any advice would be greatly appreciated. you guys seem to know your stuff!
>
> thanks in advance,
>
> cyndi
>
Cyndi,
As for the oil problem, I don't know. But I can help you with
the turning noise as my 1987 4WD did the same thing, and any
1986-1995 IFS truck will do through time. There are a total of
four small plastic caps mounted on the lower A-arms of the front
suspension that wear through from years of sharp turning that can be
replaced for a total of $4.00 at the Toyota dealer. The caps are
mounted on the end of a metal bolt that keep the wheels from scraping
against the insides of the fenders when you turn sharp. (I believe
this is designed so if you add larger/wider tires you can adjust them
to keep from tearing out the plastic fender liners.)
I was happy to find that it took only $4.00 and about 30 seconds
to alieviate this annoying noise. :-)
Hope I was helpful.
Ken Emanuel
1987 X-tra Cab SR5 4WD
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 14:19:55 -0700
From: Matt Southcott
Subject: name that noise....
To: TLCAL@tlca.org
The noise i can help you with as for the headgasket I can only advise you.
I advise you to repair it promptly if it is a V6 toyota motor they had many
problems with the head gaskets on them not so much on the 22RE though. The
noise is your nylon steering stops rubbing on the lower control arm when at
full lock. If there is any suspension movement it makes a wicked noise that
echoes off of all buildings around you and draws undesired attention to you.
It is not a serious problem some nylon lubricant would stop the noice for a
about a month or so depending on rain fall but not to worry about. Just
don't turn your wheel to full lock.
Matt
REAL PORTION of Microsoft Windows code:
while (memory_available) {
eat_major_portion_of_memory (no_real_reason);
if (feel_like_it)
make_user_THINK (this_is_an_OS);
gates_bank_balance++;
}
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 09:17:46 -0500
From: Ed.Wong@astramerck.com
Subject: Noises
To: " - (052)toy4x4 (a) tlca.org" ,
>>
Tim Davis wrote complaining about a "swirling rattle noise" coming from
his tranny... I have that same problem, but mine only happens when
the truck is in gear (usu. 3rd or 4th) and coasting. It usually happens
when I've been going about 50+ MPH and then let off the gas. What the hell
is that?
<<
The "let off the gas at speed howl" is more likely to be a rear diff issue
(pinion bearing) thatn it is to be a tranny issue - esp it if it ONLY happens
when at speed (aka 40+ Mph).
Mine's been thrashed for over 100K but I keep putting spacers in (new crush
sleeve and seals) and keep an eye on the oil levels.
Actually - about 20K ago - I pulled the bearing out and it fell apart. I
didnt have time to figure out how to get the race out w/o taking the diff
apart - and I had to get to work the next day (I was 120 miles from home
at my parents house - they have the garage) Anyway - I had a new bearing
(I had knwon it was going, and was trying to figure out a way to "pull"
the race out w/o taking apart the diff). I just put the new bearing in on
the chewed up race - and croseed my fingers. Its held for 20K now and is as
quiet as can be.
There are a pair of tru-tracs and 4.56s' wait for when it gets warmer so I
can deal with the whole shebang.
EWong
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 09:07:15 -0500
From: Ed.Wong@astramerck.com
Subject: T Case problem
To: " - (052)Toy4x4 (a) tlca.org" ,
Michael:
Sorry to hear about you T case woes.
Actually - its "probably" just the rear bearing - and it can be yanked w/o
taking the T-case out of the truck (at least on the 4 cyl manauls - gear
driven T case). (at least I recall taking apart the case w/o taking it out
of the truck)
BUT - its probably not as cheap as you might think.
If I recall right - $50 to $80 for the bearing (although If recall right -
that one at least has a bearing part number so you could just source it
anywhere)
The problem is if there is any damage further in the case - then you spend $$
chasing stuff down and more than the chearper route - getting a junkyard
T-Case
Last I checked $300 to $500 gets a T-Case.
If you dont care about a tad of "whine" and rumble - pull the rear bearing
off and add some new seals. - hopefully get away with $150 max
EWong
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 22:18:56 -0700
From: Scott Rowin
Subject: '86 Front end noise
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>
>I've been getting a thunking noise in the front end of my '86 standard cab,
>especially when going over bumps. It's mostly the little bumps like going
>through gutters or on washboard dirt roads.
- ---------------------------------------
Scott, I had exactly these symptoms a few months ago and here's what the
problem was. I also have a 1986 4X standard bed truck. I had at some
point apparently hit and damaged the driver's side lower control arm's
rear bushing. After many miles of use, the bushing slowly degraded and
the control arm was loose in its "socket". Not a pretty picture. Anyway,
the dealer wanted $50 per bushing, and of course you replace them both,
so that would have been $100, plus another $50 for installation in the
old arm. Now, a whole new lower control arm assembly from Toyota was
$180, so that's what I did. Getting that darned thing in and out was a
bit of a pain. Suffice to say I had to use a big crowbar to leverage the
new control arm in and also had to replace the lower ball joint thanks to
a jarhead mechanic who ruined it during its extrication. That lower ball
joint is really in there, be careful not to damage the rubber boot. So,
that took a couple of days and a LOT of expletives. Then, of course, it
needed alignment. You can tell if the bushing(s) are bad by firmly
gripping the tire and attempt to "shake" the tire. You can hear/see if
there's abnormal play around the bushings. An alignment shop should be
able to recognize this pretty fast too, maybe you could get a free
estimate somewhere.
Also, I found when I installed my new Bilstein shocks, you've got to be
sure to correctly tighten the front shock's top locknut. Mine was loose
and caused an awful rattle and ruined the bushing which had to be
replaced. So, check these two things out.
I would think another remote possibility are your front bearings may be
worn, or the lock nut in there is loose. Have you repacked them lately?
I should also mention I do a moderate amount of off-roading, mainly due
to my hiking projects which is to climb all the named mountain ranges in
CA and AZ. Matter of fact, I'm off to Saline/Death Valley this noon.
Good luck,
Mark Adrian
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 17:51:48 -0700
From: James Brink
Subject: Timing and clutch
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Brian Gallus wrote:
>
> I was working on the ole Runner last night, getting everything ready
> for a weekend of wheeling. Thought I should check the timing (haven't
> done so yet - had the truck 3 months). Jumped the check block, hooked
> up the timing light, marked the notche with white paint and WHOA!!!!!!
> The VICA tag says 5 degrees, but it looked like about 35 degrees!!!!
> Stopped and double checked to see what I did wrong, rechecked and got
> the same results! Adjusted to 5 degrees and the thing would do no
> more than idle, so I put everything back where I found it. It has a
> bit of a miss on idle but otherwise runs great and doesn't ping at
> all. I have recently replaced plugs, wires (both Splitfire.. wanted
> to try the wires), cap and rotor, filter, pcv, etc. Haven't yet
> replaced the coil.
>
> Anyway, is it possible that the original owner had the timing belt
> replaced and it wasn't indexed properly? Any other ideas? As
> mentioned, it runs fine, but I have absolutely no way to tell what the
> timing is set at.
>
> Also, while checking the timing I noticed another unusual little item.
> Put the tranny in nutrual and let out the clutch only to hear a
> strange clicking sound coming from the bell-housing. The sound goes
> away with the cluth pedal pushed in, or even if the pedal is pushed
> down 3/8" - enough to remove all of the "slack" in the system. I have
> not bled the system yet, and as far as I know, everything is stock.
>
> Thanks in advance...
> Brian Gallus
Check the adjustment of the Throttle Position Sensor. If the sensor is
out of limits or malfunctioning, it can make setting the timing
impossible. Since you mentioned a timing BELT, I assume this is a 3VZ-E
3.0L V6, right?
The clicking noise is quite possibly a dry or mis-adjusted throwout
bearing--either the bearing is not properly installed on the fork, the
ball-stud pivot for the fork is worn, or the fork may be cracked. It
could also be a bad input shaft bearing but this would make more of a
light knock.
- --
Jim Brink 1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net 32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
Stock 4.10 gears
Rear Lock-Right (TRD)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 09:47:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: gfrancis@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg S. Francis)
Subject: '86 Front end noise
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>I've been getting a thunking noise in the front end of my '86 standard cab,
>especially when going over bumps. It's mostly the little bumps like going
>through gutters or on washboard dirt roads.
>
I had a similar clunking noise in my front end (ifs) an discovered that it
was caused by my ball joints. Three of the four were shot!
Greg S. Francis
University of Texas @ Austin
School of Architecture
gfrancis@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
TLCA Member #5558
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 14:59:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonathan Albrecht
Subject: Clanking 4Runner
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
> The front end of my 90 4Runner "clanks" when I drive after about 5 minutes.
> It goes away as soon as I tap the brakes. I let up off of the brakes and it
> comes back. The clanking is proportional to vehicle speed not engine speed
> which makes me think brakes or tranny. Any suggestions? I recently had new
> brake pads in the front and a new halfshaft put in the right side. I have a
> feeling that the mechanic at the shop messed something up but I want to get
> an idea of what might be wrong before I go about acusing him of
> incompetence.
This exact thing happened to my friend '86 p/u last summer. It turned
out that one of the retainer pin/spring deals on the caliper had rusted
and fallen off. The new one was about 8 dollars I think, and you only
need to remove the wheel to put it on. Try comparing the left caliper
to the right one, and you should be able to tell if this is the problem.
Good luck,
__
Jonathan Albrecht
albr9619@uidaho.edu
http://www.uidaho.edu/~albr9619/
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 18:51:20 -0500 (CDT)
From: gfrancis@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Greg S. Francis)
Subject: Clanking 4Runner
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>I realize that this might be difficult to diagnose with just my description
>but here goes:
>
>The front end of my 90 4Runner "clanks" when I drive after about 5 minutes.
I had a similar problem after replacing my front pads. There is a wire
clip which holds the two retainer pins in place. (These pins hold the pads
inside the calipers). I left this clip off, and one of the pins slid
outboard and began making contact with the inside of the wheel. The
symptoms were exactly as you described. If this has happened to you, you
simply need to replace the pin(s) as they will be bent after rubbing the
wheel. Hope this helps.
Greg S. Francis
University of Texas @ Austin
School of Architecture
gfrancis@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
TLCA Member #5558
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 18:03:17 -0700
From: James Brink
Subject: Clanking 4Runner
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Jonathan Albrecht wrote:
>
> > The front end of my 90 4Runner "clanks" when I drive after about 5 minutes.
> > It goes away as soon as I tap the brakes. I let up off of the brakes and it
> > comes back. The clanking is proportional to vehicle speed not engine speed
> > which makes me think brakes or tranny. Any suggestions? I recently had new
> > brake pads in the front and a new halfshaft put in the right side. I have a
> > feeling that the mechanic at the shop messed something up but I want to get
> > an idea of what might be wrong before I go about acusing him of
> > incompetence.
>
> This exact thing happened to my friend '86 p/u last summer. It turned
> out that one of the retainer pin/spring deals on the caliper had rusted
> and fallen off. The new one was about 8 dollars I think, and you only
> need to remove the wheel to put it on. Try comparing the left caliper
> to the right one, and you should be able to tell if this is the problem.
>
> Good luck,
> __
> Jonathan Albrecht
> albr9619@uidaho.edu
> http://www.uidaho.edu/~albr9619/
Johnathan might be on to something. If the hardware is missing, ask your
dealer for "fit kit", P/N 04947-60060. This contains a set of
anti-rattle springs for the S12+8 four piston caliper disc brakes. These
springs keep the pads pushed slightly away from the rotors to prevent
squealing.
If the hardware is present, it sounds like the machanic forgot to
reinstall the bolt and (large) washer, snap ring, and/or spacer washer.
I've seen this a few times where these "spare parts" were left out
during hub/axle/rotor repairs.
- --
Jim Brink 1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net 32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
Stock 4.10 gears
Rear Lock-Right (TRD)
------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 22:18:56 -0700
From: Scott Rowin
Subject: '86 Front end noise
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>
>I've been getting a thunking noise in the front end of my '86 standard cab,
>especially when going over bumps. It's mostly the little bumps like going
>through gutters or on washboard dirt roads.
Probably need to repack/rebuild the front drive shafts. They tend
to dry out and when they do, you'll get creaks/clunks when going over bumps,
turning, etc. A simple test is to drive it - turn the wheels hard both
directions when going forward. If it clunks/creaks/clicks, then you'll need
to repack and check the CV joints (front drive shafts). Also check the
boots - that rubber only lasts a while, and probably if they're the
originals, they're shot.
- - Scott
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 07 May 1997 17:28:13 -0700
From: James Brink
Subject: steering U joint
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Matthew C Chapin wrote:
Has anyone ever had their steering U joint go bad? I hear a "thump" when
I turn my wheel from side to side. I am pretty sure the sound is coming
from that joint.
This could also be the upper bearing in the steering column...
I also have a problem in my driveshaft?? When I step on the gas the
truck body surges backward, The same thing happens when I let my foot
off the gas except it surges forward. I was thinking this might be due
to a loose slip joint in the driveshaft. Is that my problem or is it
something
else?
Possibly a broken center bolt in one of the rear leaf springs??? Anyone
else with ideas?
- --
Jim Brink 1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net 32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
Stock 4.10 gears
Rear Lock-Right (TRD)
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 12:46:58 EDT
From: markadrian@juno.com (Mark D Adrian)
Subject: Front end question/problem
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Lately, I have noticed what I can best describe as a rattle coming from
somewhere in my front end (1986 4x IFS) and it usually manifests on very
bumpy roads, although I can hear the same noise when I hit those
bots-dots highway reflectors. It sounds kind of like two nested tin cans
shaken together. I have new Bilstein shocks and have recently replaced
the brake rotors and repacked the bearings having the noise before and
after that maintenance activity. I've replaced the shocks and the
driver's side lower control arm. The alignment shop I would think would
have alerted me to any other front end suspension/linkage problems, but
they said everything was "fine". Now, the only thing I can think of
that's left is the IFS torsion bar components, or it's a very subtle
component malfunction somewhere else that the alignment shop missed. I
did reuse the old wheel bearings which "looked" OK as I wasn't sure how
to assess their credibility. Any ideas or anyone else had a similar
scenario? Right now, it's just an audible annoyance, but, it could
degrade into something worse.
Mark
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 14:28:47
From: Ed Ruf
Subject: Front end question/problem
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
AT 12:46 5/12/97 EDT, Mark D Adrian wrote:
>Lately, I have noticed what I can best describe as a rattle coming from
>somewhere in my front end (1986 4x IFS) and it usually manifests on very
>bumpy roads,
First thing I'd check is that the upper and lower shock mounts are
tight. This type of noise could easily be the shock rattling around in
the mounts and it's really easy to check. Just grab the shock body and t
to shake it back and forth while looking at the mounts.
ED
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 12:25:26 -0700
From: Scott Wilson
Subject: Front end question/problem
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Mark D Adrian wrote:
>
> Lately, I have noticed what I can best describe as a rattle coming from
> somewhere in my front end (1986 4x IFS) and it usually manifests on very
> bumpy roads, although I can hear the same noise when I hit those
> bots-dots highway reflectors. It sounds kind of like two nested tin cans
> shaken together.
I wonder if it could be the lockable hub. I have the factory auto hubs
on my 88 4Runner, and I've noticed lately it rattles sometimes over bot
dots and whatnot. I don't have any experience working on hubs (yet). I
assuming it's OK, to hear a little noise out of 'em at times, after all
mine have 127miles one 'em right now. Sound OK?
Scott
- --
Scott A. Wilson __o __o __o __o
Santa Clara, CA _'\<,_ _'\<,_ _'\<,_ _'\<,_
swilson@pacbell.net (_)' (_) (_)' (_) (_)' (_) (_)' (_)
http://users.uniserve.com/~rcomber/scottw/scottw.htm
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 21:43:44 -0700
From: James Brink
Subject: Front end question/problem
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
>
> AT 12:46 5/12/97 EDT, Mark D Adrian wrote:
> >Lately, I have noticed what I can best describe as a rattle coming
> from
> >somewhere in my front end (1986 4x IFS) and it usually manifests on
> very
> >bumpy roads, although I can hear the same noise when I hit those
> >bots-dots highway reflectors. It sounds kind of like two nested tin
> cans
> >shaken together.
> First thing I'd check is that the upper and lower shock mounts are
> tight. This type of noise could easily be the shock rattling around in
> the mounts and it's really easy to check. Just grab the shock body and t
> to shake it back and forth while looking at the mounts.
>
> ED
All IFS trucks up to 1990 (?) use a bronze or oilite bushing in both
ends of the spindle to support the axle shafts. In time these bushings
wear and allow the axle to "bounce" or jiggle around in the hollow
spindle. The fix? Replace the bushings. Beginning with '89 models, an
in-service change to bearings was made but I believe this can not be
retrofitted to the earlier trucks. Bummer.
To replace the bushings, the entire spindle assy. needs to be removed
from the vehicle. Probably not worth repairing unless: a) It is really
loose, or b) the front-end is torn-down for ball-joint replacement,
spindle replacement, installing new upper/lower control arms (lift
installation).
I have not done many of these repairs. Does no seem to be a real
concern.
- --
Jim Brink 1986 Standard Bed 4X4/22R
Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 135,000 Miles
brinkjm@earthlink.net 32" BFG All-Terrain T/As
Stock 4.10 gears
Rear Lock-Right (TRD)
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 19:44:24 -0400
From: Ed.Wong@astramerck.com
Subject: IFS bump stop spacing
To: " - (052)toy4x4 (a) tlca.org"
To the guy that was complaining about a front rattle - mine does it from the
shock bolts (the holes are no longer round!)
So - if you get the dual Bilstein hoops - I strongly urge you to get the weld
on brace and weld it on! (I assume that if you read this list you use yer
truck)
EWong
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 May 1997 13:40:41 EDT
From: markadrian@juno.com (Mark D Adrian)
Subject: Front end noise/problem/rattle
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Well, I want to thank everyone who replied. To recap all the potential
causes, here they are :
1) Spindle bushing wear, replace inner and outer bushings.
2) Ball joint wear, replace upper and lower ball joints.
3) Hubs, replace/repair locking hubs.
4) Loose shocks, inspect upper shock post lock nut and bushings.
Mark
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 17:58:47 -0700
From: "Will Watt"
Subject: Manual Transmission Woes
To:
I just got a pretty good deal on a 87 4runner a couple weeks ago. It
has 118,000 miles on a 22RE engine with 31" superdiggers on it. Cost me
$2200 but has some body damage on the passenger side because I think it was
tipped on it's side. It runs great! I put some Splitfires in and adjusted
the valves. I put a Downey header on for some more power with a K&N for
breath. I love my new partner in crime and have named it Hughbert.
Enough with the emotional stuff. I Have had some recent trouble with my
transmission. I replaced the fluid in it the other day with Syntec 75w-90.
On my way back from the local ski area which is about a 300 mile round-trip
journey I started to hear this kind of chattery whine in 5th gear. I now
have this noise pinned to certain characteristics. It only happens when
accelerating never when downshifting or coasting . And it does it in all
gears except Reverse and 4th. It Started doing it in all other gears
suddenly while going down the highway at about 75. Can anyone help me?
This is very discouraging as I am very eager to get cover some
magnificent terrain in my 4Runner
Thank You very much
Will
Montana
frk4sno@mcn.net
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 19:39:50 -0600
From: breeze@cysource.com (Jeffrey Delzer)
Subject: Manual Transmission Woes
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:48:03 -0600
From: John Schultz
Subject: Manual Transmission Woes
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
Just happened to me about a month ago. Identical symptoms. It was a bearing
on the main shaft. I just had the whole thing rebuilt. Cost me $600.00
parts and labor here in Missouri, I had all bearings replaced though.
John
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:22:26 -0600
From: Mike Tolliver
Subject: Manual Transmission Woes
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I had exactly the same problem. Mine was the rear roller bearing on the main
shaft.
Mike Tolliver
t1der@bellsouth.net
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:51:28 -0800
From: Jim Brink
Subject: Not the Pulley bearing
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
lewis winston wrote:
>
> Hello again,
> Here's a progress report: I pulled the tensioner pulley and cranked
> the engine up and still got a squeeling noise. I looked at the service
> manual and got to wondering if this might be a crankshaft bearing.
Are you certian that it is coming from the front of the engine? Could it
be a throwout bearing and the noise is travelling to the front of the
motor?
If you had a bad crank bearing, it would do more than squeal.
> Anybody have an oil pump go on them? If so what did it sound like?
Like a spoon in a garbage disposal (if the engine still runs at that
point).
- --
Jim Brink, Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 1986 Std. Bed 4x4
Manhattan Beach, CA 32x11.50/15 BFG M/Ts
ToyTech@Off-Road.com
********************************************************************
TLCA - Friends of the Mojave Road (FOMR) - CA4WDC
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:55:24 -0700
From: daves8@juno.com (DAVE SCHOENBERG)
Subject: Not the Pulley bearing
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
No, No, No, neither engine bearings or oil pump will squeal- they'l
knock like crazy but that's it. I think the timing chain would only
knock, too. I don't believe anything in there can squeal, but I'm sure
Jim Brink could answer this more accurately. I've replaced many timing
chains over the years and never heard one squeal. (I did squeal a little
when I bought the parts for my 22RE, but that's another story.)
Normally, oil pumps in ANY engine are EXTREMELY reliable; Toys have a
gear pump mounted directly to the crankshaft and there just ain't much to
go wrong- certainly nothing to squeal.
Pull all the belts off the engine and start it up, I bet your squeal goes
away. Then replace them one by one with good tension and see
As far as your oil light staying on, put a "genuwine" Toyota filter on it
and see what happens. Try 20W50 oil if your idle pressure is getting too
low. I run it year-round in Colorado; if it gets below about 15 degrees
I plug the block heater into a lamp timer and start warming the engine up
a couple of hours before I go to work.
Anyway, the important part, the squeal is not an engine bearing, oil
pump or timing chain (sure about the first two and almost sure about the
last).
Dave Schoenberg, Arvada, Colorado-----Who else gives advice like this???
-----------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:58:38 -0800
From: Scott Muir
Subject: Not the Pulley bearing
To: "Toy4x4@tlca.org"
DAVE SCHOENBERG wrote:
>No, No, No, neither engine bearings or oil pump will squeal- they'l
>knock like crazy but that's it. I think the timing chain would only
>knock, too. I've replaced many timing
>chains over the years and never heard one squeal.
I'm just catching the tail end of this one, but HM2C, (here's my 2 cents)
Last year this time, my engine was squeeling. (refer to "stuck pig" in
the digest search engine). Again, I can't say absolutely it was the
timing chain, but when I got it open, one of the guides had snapped at
the bolt eye and was free to move around. It's an 85 22re with about
270K Km's on it. I can't really remember how bad the sound was, but it
made people look at stop lights. I seem to remember it was a little
intermittent and was loudest when the engine was first started on cold
mornings. (frosty am's for instance) If you do end up doing the chain,
I recommend getting the OEM chain and parts. I have a couple of
friends who didn't and ended up changing to OEM shortly thereafter.
Scott.
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:11:50 -0500
From: Andrew Hojnowski
Subject: Noisy gears
To: toy4x4@tlca.org
Hey everyone,
I have a question about my gears, or transfer case, I'm not sure where the
noise is coming from. I have the 22R engine, well When I go into 5th gear
there is a loud hummm coming from the transmission. It only does it in
fith gear, and it gets louder as I go faster, but I can't hear it if I let
off the gas. Could this be a symptom af a cracked gear, or do I need a new
transmission? I checek all the fluids and the are fine. Thanks!
Andrew>>>>>>85, 4x4 std. bed>>many extras.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:16:40 -0600
From: Mike Tolliver
Subject: Noisy gears
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I had exactly the same symptoms with my 86 5speed. Noisy in 5th, and only
5th, and only when I applied gas. Its one of your roller bearings
(probably the rear on the output shaft) starting to go bad. I guess 5th
gets noisy first because its on the opposite side of the bearing from the
other gears and generates different stresses.?
Time for a rebuild.
Mike Tolliver
t1der@bellsouth.net
------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 16:31:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ken Emanuel
Subject: 22R NOISE
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
On Tue, 10 Mar 1998, C.G. Smith wrote:
> I know this has probably been beat to death..but are there any Toyota
> techs out there that can explain my noisy 89 22RE?? Valves are adjusted
> per service manual.........TWICE!!!!...Engine runs GREAT!!
The valves on my 22R-E are the quietest ones I've heard--and the Toyota
mechanic responded by saying "then they need to be adjusted." So if your
valves clack following a careful valve adjustment (hot), your valves are
probably adjusted just as they should be.
Everyone I've talked to said that Toyotas have noisy valve train, but to
not worry about it because they are among the longest lasting engines
made.
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Ken Emanuel Emanuel@csus.edu
'87 Xtra Cab SR5 (22R-E)
http://webpages.csus.edu/~sac75830/toystuff.htm
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:16:32 -0800
From: Jim Brink
Subject: 22R NOISE
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
C.G. Smith wrote:
>
> I know this has probably been beat to death..but are there any Toyota
> techs out there that can explain my noisy 89 22RE?? Valves are adjusted
> per service manual.........TWICE!!!!...Engine runs GREAT!! No oil loss,
> no power loss, just a valve like ticking only audible at idle. Its not
> really a slapping, and it is NOT coming from the timing chain
> area....Every 22R I have had does this.....Last one went 246k before
> warping the head because of a gauge malfunction.........It made this
> noise for 100k easy. Are these motors just inherently noisy?? My '89
> Runnner w/EFI has the noise...but my carbed '86 had it to??? Any
> comments or suggestions greatly appreciated..........
It is inherent in the "R" series engines. Valve lash is purely
mechanical, rockers on valves, so the noise is just the metal-to-metal
tapping.
- --
Jim Brink, Toyota/ASE Certified Technician 1986 Toyota Std. Bed 4WD
Manhattan Beach, CA 32x11.50/15 BFG M/Ts
ToyTech@Off-Road.com
************************************************************************
TLCA - Friends of the Mojave Road (FOMR) - CA4WDC
Visit http://www.off-road.com Putting Off-Road, Online!
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 23:56:30 -0500
From: Jeff Tamulis
Subject: Ticking 22R and why it does it.
To: cb_5@hotmail.com, Toy Mailing List
I had the same problem with my 1986 Toyota 2WD (and all of them
actually). I just discovered what it was on the 1986. On the front of
the block, where the MANUAL fuel pump is on a CARB truck, its the cam
hitting the fuel pump. If you have a CARB truck, you can put your hand
on the fuel pump, and you can feel it. and know for certain thats where
its coming from. NOW if you have a fuel injected motor, the cam inside
the block is still ticking, it just seems to come from no-where. Thecam
is whats making the noise. When the truck gets lots of oil pressure
(away from idle) The ticking seems to get less. I think this has
something to do with it. But the ticking is from inside the block, and
if you have a carb the vibration that is causing the ticking is directly
touching the manual fuel pump, causing you to be able to feel it there.
If you have a carb truck, go outside and feel your pump. You'll
understand exactly what I'm talking about.
Jeff
jtamulis@sph.unc.edu
1982 4x4, 1978 2WD, 1986 2WD, 1984 4x4 Xtra-Cab, 1987 4Runner (with a
Ford 5.0 going in soon)
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:30:42 -0600
From: "Jones, Travis"
Subject: 22R NOISE - CG SMITH
To: "'toy4x4@tlca.org'"
I can feel your pain. I have a 92 xcab 4x4 with a 22RE. Bought it with
only 7k on it from dealer. somewhere around 15k i had your noise.
never took it in until after warranty ran out. dealer said it was the
dummy pulley for the belt going to my ac. I replaced it, no results.
damn pulley was $60 bucks.
anyway many miles later i figured it out. for some reason, escapes me,
the distributor unit was making the noise. by mistake one day i leaned
my hand on the distributor cap pushing kinda down and towards the cab
while my engine was on and the noise disappeared. I then just took
plastic quick ties and put them around the cap and anchored them below
to keep the pressure (only slight pressure) on the cap. the noise never
came back except when the ties had loosened.
it appears, i guess, to be a fault in the stem going into the head from
the distributor. I know this isn't very technical but i know exactly
the noise your talking about, at idle it ticks, and if you slightly rev
up it goes away.
------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 19:50:29 -0800
From: Antony Wilson
Subject: 22R Valve Noise
To: Toy4x4@tlca.org
I have had first hand experience with this little prob. You can set the
clearances perfectly, then crank the valve cover nuts too much and it
lifts the rocker arm assembly up, thereby increasing all/some of your
perfectly set valve clearances and the noise returns.
Try it, go out back and crank down the valve cover nuts, it doesn't
take much to lift the assembly and you'll hear it immediately.
Antony
Scott Muir wrote-
*****************
I caught wind of this a while back. Someone with some experience might
wanna confirm this, but if you torque down the valve cover nuts too far,
it's possible to make the cover contact the valve train. That could add a
whole new drummer to the rhythm section.
******************
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 10:58:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Eli Madden
Subject: Whistle Noise
I've heard several people say they have a whistle-like noise when they
accelerate. I had the same thing and found that the fitting for the EGR
(exhaust gas recirculation) system on the passenger side rear of the head
had come loose. It got so loose I was leaking oil BAD out the bolt holes.
I have a 22R, I don't know if 22REs have the same thing.......
Hope this helps.
Eli Madden, N1XCZ
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:46:58 -0700
From: David Fritzsche
Subject: re: Creaking Suspension
>I went 4-wheeling in the Sierras about 2 weeks ago on some rocky
>trails. It was dry with some dust. The problem I am experiencing
>is an annoying creak which occurs when I am stopping or driving
>away from a stop. It appears to have something to do with the
>suspension loading or unloading. I am thinking that something
>down there is dry or has a bunch of dust in it. I cleaned the
>underside of the truck with a hose when we got back but the
>noise was still there afterwards.
>
> Any suggestions?
What I would do is to take end wrenches and socket set, an air hose, a
couple of cold whatever you drink, a sandwich or two crawl under your
truck and make sure that everything with a nut, bolt or screw is tight.
Then I would jack up the back to unload the suspension use the air hose
and blow the dust and dirt out of the springs. If you want to get real
anal you could pull the rear springs and take them apart, clean and put
some grease between the leaves and on the shackle and spring hanger
bolts or get some anti-fiction pads to go between the spring leaves (
NWOR has them) . I would also spray all of the rubber stuff--shock
bushings with silicon spray. If you have leaves in the front repeat the
process. If it IFS, install zerk fittings into the ball joints and all
of the other things that you can and lube the front end good while the
suspension is unloaded and spray all of the rubber bushings. I will
not guarantee that this is going to fix it but at least you know that
everything
After I did Fordyce creek a couple of weeks ago I had a creaking noise
and I thought it was in the rear leaves and come to find out one of the
Nerf bars was a little loose.
David Fritzsche, 1990 V-6 ex-cab, Pro-Comp II Lift, Rancho 9000 Shocks,
Marlin Gear Change, 4:88 Gears, Tru-Trak Front, ARB rear, 33"
BFG-MT's,Warn8000, Custom Rear Bumper, Winch Mount, Re-Worked
Smitty-Built Nerf Bars, CB Mount, Skid Plates all designed and built by
owner (Man! I hope they don't fall off)
------------------------------
------------------------------
>From: Smith, Steve [SMTP:SSmith@stai.com]
>I should have been more descriptive...The clunk happens whether I'm in 2WD
>or 4WD, whether the hubs are lockes or not. I hear it near the front
>driver's side. I've had my girlfriend to stop and I was outside trying to
>hear it, but it's very hard to hear from the outside vs. inside. It seems
>like if I stop hard for an extended time (continuing to increase brake
>pressure) I get more than one clunk. Any ideas guys?
>Steve S.
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 00:12:24 -0700
From: Scott Lindsey
Subject: Re: Clunk when stopping
To me, that sounds like a front suspension problem. Check the four bolts on the
lower control arm (can pull the front wheel if you want but don't have to) and
make sure that none have broken off or worked themselves loose. There should be
four. This is a potentially very dangerous condition to drive the car in... My
guess is that you have only one bolt out of four and that one is loose. Once
the last bolt gives, there is nothing but the axle to stop your wheel from
going from vertical to horizontal! And yes, the same clunk happened to me!!!
Scott_Lindsey@csi.com
Mesa, AZ
Motorola 4-wheelers, ICOC
'91 4-Runner, 31X10.5's BFG's, Rear Lockright, Rancho 5K's
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 15:34:34 -0700
From: Scott Muir
Subject: Re: Clunk when I stop
Smith, Steve wrote:
>
> Man,
>It sure is easier to describe a problem on the Cruiser list ;)
> It's a solid axle.
>
> Steve
Ah yes, but can you get an answer from the cruiser list without inciting
an argument?
Okay, here's a few ideas...
- -check your springs for broken leaves. (could be flexing and grinding on
each other) Check the spring eyes.
- -make sure your calliper bolts are tight.
- -Inspect your torque rod, sway bar, tie rod, t/r ends, drag link.
- -are the u-bolts tight?
If its none of these things then it is probably your king-pin bearings.
Jack up one wheel at a time and wiggle it with hands at 3-9 o'clock, and
again with hands at 12-6 o'clock. excessive play or clunking?
As for how to fix this, well, I think you need to check out barney's
archives.
http://www.scruz.net/~barneym/toy_root/techneek/conewash.htm
will be of interest to you.
This is easy, just takes a long time to do, and it's messy. It also
requires a special tool or 2 that you can probably borrow from
somewhere. (ie: 54mm or 2 1/8" deep socket, torque wrench)
S.
------------------------------
-----------------------------
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 07:32:53 -0700
From: "Ladd Howell"
Subject: RE: Toyota 4x4 digest: V2 #98
Ron,
Check the clutch fork connection to the slave cylinder. I bought a 95 T100
Ex-Cab 4x4 last December from a Ford dealer (first mistake). The next day I
noticed a chirping sound when the clutch pedal was out. Pressing on the
pedal made it disappear. My first thought was T/O bearing. Took it back to
the dealer, their synopsis was T/O bearing and they agreed to fix. I talked
them out of a new clutch also. Got the truck back with the same chirp. After
taking back to them several times with no resolution, took it to a Toyota
dealer, they listened and said T/O bearing. Took to another Toyota house,
T/O bearing. Took to another Toy house who put it on a lift and greased this
connection. Chirp gone. It has returned , however no damage is being done so
I haven't worried about. I have not had time to investigate the joint, but
the adjustment is a much better solution than just grease and doubt if you
are experiencing any slippage.
On a different subject, the first time I got the truck back after
replacement of the clutch and T/O, the clutch would not release properly.
After numerous trips back to the dealer and about a month in a rental at
their expense, they replaced the slave cylinder with no result. Finally a
crack was found at the firewall where the master cylinder is mounted. Their
fix supposedly recommended by Toy, was to weld a plate to the firewall and
remount the master. I was non too happy with this, but to their credit, the
mend is virtually un-noticeable and fixed the problem.
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 12:10:29 -0400
From: "Ron Rollinson"
Subject: weird clutch noise
Guys, I have a 94 4x4 with the V-6 engine in it. Lately, I have been
noticing a weird high pitched (kind of like a chirp) sound coming from what
appears to be my clutch. I only hear it when the clutch pedal is totally
out (in or out of gear) and I can make it disappear by resting my foot on
the clutch pedal or depressing the clutch pedal a very small amount (say
1/2"). I examined the clutch pedal mechanism and realize I can adjust the
pedal to provide the pressure needed to get rid of the noise. While
driving I've tried to tell if this would cause any slippage and I really
can't see it causing any. Any thoughts on what this might be?
Thanks,
Ron Rollinson
ronr@nowonder.com
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 15:19:13 -0800
From: Steve Harron
Subject: RE: Toyota 4x4 digest: V2 #268
> Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 12:22:53 -0500
> From: Palmer David DA
> Subject: V6 Back From Service -- Strange new noise...
>
> The only thing that concerns me is a new noise to the engine -- it sounds
> like a "Grrrrrrrrr". I hear the noise at idle and low RPMs, and the tone
> of the "grrrr" is proportional to engine speed. The only thing I can liken
> it to is the noise my friend's alternator made in the few weeks before it
> failed.
>
> If anyone has any guesses as to what the noise is, let me know!
>
>
OK, I've had this happen three times. EVERY TIME IT HAPPENED WAS
WHEN THE DEALER WORKED ON THE TRUCK!! It was the power steering pump
pulley. Go get your big breaker bar and socket and tighten the nut on the
front of the pump pulley. I ended up having to use a lock washer to keep
this from happening (along with not going back to the dealer). Hope this
solves the problem.
Steve Harron
95 4Runner - V6 - Quiet Power Steering Pump
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 22:19:03 EST
From: CowbyUp77@aol.com
Subject: Vibrations
I've got a new problem I hope y'all can help me with. When I start moving
forward I get a choppy vibration coming from the rear that lasts up till about
20-25mph, in any gear. When I go backward it's normal. I'm thinking that
it's from one of my tires wearing poorly, but am unsure. It seems to be
getting worse, at least to a point.
It couldn't be something mechanical could it? Like the tranny, driveline, or
pumpkin?
Any help would be appreciated.
Chuck "Dawg" Thomas Ashland, Oregon
'85 Toy Xtra-cab
Custom front bumper & lightbar
'78 Chevy (kinda a F.O.R.D for now)
Lifted & beat up
============================================================================
Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 19:37:27 -0800
From: Chris Geiger
Subject: Re: Vibrations
Sounds like the ring gear has lost a tooth. Change the rear diff oil, if
important things like the teeth come out with the oil, it's time for new
gears.
Chris Geiger
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 21:33:43 -0800
From: Dee Smith
Subject: Re: Vibrations
One way to find out about the 3rd member (pumpkin) is to pull it.
I had to do this on my '84 Toyota std. cab 4WD.
My '84 needed the front and rear bearings replaced on the rear
differential. The parts were Not very expensive.
However the task was time consuming.
The good news:
Now my truck has NO slop when taking off in first or reverse. :-)
HTH
Regards,
M.D. Smith
------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:50:50 -0700
From: Duke Hayduk
Subject: Clunking in driveshaft
I was getting ready to take my '90 SR5 V6 Xtra Cab 4x4 Pickup in to the
dealer to have them repair whatever it was that was causing the clanking
(not clunking) in the driveshaft. Since I live out in the dingleweeds
(Bluff, Southeast Utah), a trip to the dealer is kind of a production.
So I put it off. A week or so later, I thought, "I haven't lubed the
drive line for awhile and have been wandering some dusty roads--better
give it a lube job and do it myself." As I was feeding the grease into
one of those fittings (can't recall which one), I noticed as the grease
went in, the driveshaft (it's two pieces there--one piece slides over
the other smaller circumference piece) was "expanding."
The pressure of the grease filling up whatever space it was filling up
was pushing the two shafts apart. At the time this was occurring, I
just noticed it and thought, "Huh?" Later on, I moved the truck out of
the garage and proceeded to try to clean myself up, all the while
thinking again to myself, "I understand now why people pay somebody else
to do this job." Then, I drove the two blocks to get the mail and
thought I noticed "Hey. What happened to the "clanking" in the
driveshaft?"
That was it. Needed lubrication.
Now, when it starts "clanking"--usually at the end of a gear change when
you start giving it some gas--I lube it and that's it for awhile.
I noticed somebody perplexed about the different kinds of greases the
manual specifies. I hope that's not critical--I just shoot the juice to
it--whatever's on hand. To me, there are two kinds of grease, the
blonde stuff and the black stuff.
Duke Hayduk
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